Thread: Heroin should be legalized

Hmm I believe that everything statsme said is true. So therefore, why would any of you WANT to legalize this horrendous drug?

Originally Posted by NotoriousM4^
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I believe you just contradicted yourself. Your asking me to get rid of these types of education and campaign services, and yet you suggest one yourself; and then you go on to suggest a rather blunt death waiver before using heroin?

I suggested the elimination of what you said doesn't work: anti-drug campaigns.

I would also like to know exactly what is your definition of "proper heroin use" is. I myself, do not believe heroin can be used properly seeing as there is that progression of tolerance with extended use.

What's wrong with tolerance? It is not harmful in and of itself.

My definition of "proper heroin use" is the following: 1.) use of pure heroin in measured doses, 2.) no drug combinations (i.e. heroin + cocaine), and 3.) use according to resources (no spending food money on heroin). Additives, as your quote notes, are a leading cause of problems; as one of my links (Peele's) notes, most overdoses are caused by combining drugs; and as your link also notes, prior poor health is another reason complications arise.

Also, if you are suggesting the marketing of heroin, there will always be the low grade and the high grade.

Yes, if it's illegal. If you think it will be the same with legal heroin, I would suggest you look at a medicine bottle and see how much it's been "cut".

• Chronic users may develop collapsed veins, infection of the heart lining and valves, abscesses, cellulites, and liver disease.
• Pulmonary complications, including various types of pneumonia, may result from the poor health condition of the abuser, as well as from heroin's depressing effects on respiration.
• Heroin may have additives that do not really dissolve and result in clogging the blood vessels that lead to the lungs, liver, kidneys, or brain.
• Can cause infection or even death of small patches of cells in vital organs.
• With regular heroin use, tolerance develops. This means the abuser must use more heroin to achieve the same intensity or effect.

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I'm glad someone is actually offering reasons and sources. For some reason, most people seem content to say "I think it's a bad idea" and never actually research. So there's a +1 for you. Despite that, none of this is referring to pure heroin and proper use. This is referring to common complications from street heroin use.

• Collapsed veins, absesses, and any infection can occur only due to improper injection, dirty needles, or dirty heroin. (
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• The source you quote mentions that pulmonary complications are usually due to the already poor health of the user. However, pulmonary edema (serious only if left untreated, generally) can occur and its cause is unknown. It may actually be heroin. However, it is linked to
  [Dear Visitor, you're restricted from viewing links until you are registered & logged on.
  Click Here To Register Today, which is caused by mixing drugs, and to existing lung problems. It is worth noting that no cases of pulmonary edema appear in people prescribed heroin or other opioids.
  
• The remaining problems mentioned by your source are caused by insoluble additives, as it itself admits. An interesting quote from one of the above linked sources: "Many drugs are very straining to the liver; heroin is not."

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The study shows that morphine addiction is not characterized by physical deterioration or impairment of physical fitness aside from the addiction per se. There is no evidence of change in the circulatory, hepatic, renal or endocrine functions. When it is considered that these subjects had been addicted for at least five years, some of them for as long as twenty years, these negative observations are highly significant.

(Heroin is metabolized into morphine, by the way.)
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Here are some more sources for you, so you know I'm not pulling stuff out of my ass.
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Click Here To Register Today I don't expect you to read all of them, but you can glance over them and see the consensus is clear: illegality is what makes heroin one of the most dangerous drugs... not the substance itself.

Originally Posted by xSiiKnBleed
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Hmm I believe that everything statsme said is true. So therefore, why would any of you WANT to legalize this horrendous drug?

I'm glad you agree, but puzzled as to why you wouldn't want to legalize it... :p

But more seriously, I'm a little surprised you'd buy into the government propaganda on this drug while supporting marijuana. Not that wanting to legalize one drug means you automatically should want to legalize the rest - but have you see some of the things people say about marijuana? Go to any junior high school and ask the kids what marijuana does to you. Chances are, you'll get a lot of stuff about killing brain cells and leading to harder drugs and blah blah blah.

Originally Posted by statsme
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I suggested the elimination of what you said doesn't work: anti-drug campaigns.


What's wrong with tolerance? It is not harmful in and of itself.

My definition of "proper heroin use" is the following: 1.) use of pure heroin in measured doses, 2.) no drug combinations (i.e. heroin + cocaine), and 3.) use according to resources (no spending food money on heroin). Additives, as your quote notes, are a leading cause of problems; as one of my links (Peele's) notes, most overdoses are caused by combining drugs; and as your link also notes, prior poor health is another reason complications arise.


Yes, if it's illegal. If you think it will be the same with legal heroin, I would suggest you look at a medicine bottle and see how much it's been "cut".

I'm glad someone is actually offering reasons and sources. For some reason, most people seem content to say "I think it's a bad idea" and never actually research. So there's a +1 for you. Despite that, none of this is referring to pure heroin and proper use. This is referring to common complications from street heroin use.

• Collapsed veins, absesses, and any infection can occur only due to improper injection, dirty needles, or dirty heroin. (
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• The source you quote mentions that pulmonary complications are usually due to the already poor health of the user. However, pulmonary edema (serious only if left untreated, generally) can occur and its cause is unknown. It may actually be heroin. However, it is linked to
  [Dear Visitor, you're restricted from viewing links until you are registered & logged on.
  Click Here To Register Today, which is caused by mixing drugs, and to existing lung problems. It is worth noting that no cases of pulmonary edema appear in people prescribed heroin or other opioids.
• The remaining problems mentioned by your source are caused by insoluble additives, as it itself admits. An interesting quote from one of the above linked sources: "Many drugs are very straining to the liver; heroin is not."

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(Heroin is metabolized into morphine, by the way.)
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Click Here To Register Today is a guide for doctors on whether or not to use opioids on their patients. Notice the only problem it mentions is addiction - no physical harm.

Here are some more sources for you, so you know I'm not pulling stuff out of my ass.
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Click Here To Register Today I don't expect you to read all of them, but you can glance over them and see the consensus is clear: illegality is what makes heroin one of the most dangerous drugs... not the substance itself.


I'm glad you agree, but puzzled as to why you wouldn't want to legalize it... :p

But more seriously, I'm a little surprised you'd buy into the government propaganda on this drug while supporting marijuana. Not that wanting to legalize one drug means you automatically should want to legalize the rest - but have you see some of the things people say about marijuana? Go to any junior high school and ask the kids what marijuana does to you. Chances are, you'll get a lot of stuff about killing brain cells and leading to harder drugs and blah blah blah.

It is not government propaganda, it is basic knowledge living in the city. Heroine was made to rake in cash simply because of its highly addictive substance opiate. The opiate, for a reason unknown to me, is one of the hardest drugs to quit. So people end up spending every dime they have in order to get there fix until they are broke. Then they resort to crime as second measure to accomplish there goal of getting high. It is a drug that leads women to prostitution and has a high tendency to give people aids due to needle sharing.

I'm not sure how you can blame heroin for people misusing it (i.e., sharing needles). That's like saying cars should be illegal because some people are drunk drivers. Heroin is extremely addictive (less addictive than nicotine, though), but...

Quick question: does every single heroin user spend all their money on heroin?

More pertinent question: when a commodity is outlawed and can only be acquired on the black market, what happens to its price?

Even if the heroin is pure as you say, it will lead to an addiction, and in the end you will be living on the street (unless you're a rockstar...good luck supporting your habit). You can't do your job or raise children on heroin. Heroin is the most addicting drug out there amoung with oxycottin (leaving nicotine aside).

When you lose your job and you're on the street because of heroin, the health factors do come into play. If you look at the surveys and studies available on google, you will see that the majority of homeless people are homeless due to drugs. If you dive deeper you will see that heroin, crack, and meth are the main culprits.

People who do heroin have a detatchment from reality and get a euphoric sensation; this leads to them caring about themselves and only themselves. They will do anything and everything for their next fix.

You are correct in all you say, except

Originally Posted by Netro
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You can't do your job or raise children on heroin.

The successful businessmen, or Artie Lange, quoted in two of my links above would beg to differ. Of course, Artie Lange is pretty wealthy, but the fact of the matter remains, not every person on heroin will lose their job and life.

It is extremely addictive and it certainly seems like the majority of people have problems keeping their use reasonable, I will give you that. But again, I reiterate: what happens to a product's price when it is put on the black market? Opium addicts in Laos don't have any problem supporting their habit monetarily, because it's so cheap.

If people use the stuff anyway, why not make sure it doesn't ruin their lives while they use it? It's like outlawing chocolate, and then saying "SEE? SEE? IT'S HUGELY EXPENSIVE AND ONLY DESPERATE CRIMINALS ARE INVOLVED WITH IT!"

Not all will lose there jobs or life but most will. IF legalized more people will do it because in there minds the government is treating it like everything else.

Too much to read. Statsme you argue for me please. Since we are on the same side. Just get your name changed to Llamider2 and we'll be like twins.

Wtf?

On Topic: Heroin is Yummy. How would you guys feel if i banned sex. Having heroin be illegal is like if someone banned sex. Its ridiculous! Amen.

Great minds think alike, Llamider.

But you're right. Sex should be banned. Here are some consequences of having sex:

• Sexually transmitted diseases like syphilis, chlamydia, genital warts, herpes, or AIDS kill millions of people every year!
• Nearly
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• Pregnancy can result in physical complications as well as monetary ones. Babies cost even more than a heroin addiction! Plus, some people even abandon their babies or drink alcohol while pregnant!
• STDs can not only kill you, but they can make your life a living hell - causing symptoms like insanity or uncontrollable diarrhea!
• AIDS treatment usually costs about
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As you can see, sex is much more dangerous than drugs. Sure, some people can use sex correctly... but since sex is legal, everyone thinks it's okay. If we made it illegal, and also prevented people from buying condoms or other methods of birth control and STD avoidance, the world would be such a better place!

After all, it's worked really well for drugs, hasn't it?

Originally Posted by xSiiKnBleed
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Not all will lose there jobs or life but most will. IF legalized more people will do it because in there minds the government is treating it like everything else.

That might be true. That also might not be true, because as the first link I posted shows, all evidence is that people use drugs less. But that's not even the most important thing: if heroin were legal, it would be possible to use it and have a normal life. Would everyone use it correctly? No, of course not. But it is clear that the current war on drugs is not working and only hurting the very people it's supposed to protect.

You're not the first person to copy and paste a big chunk of bullshit without reading it. You don't seem to have read either my sources or your own. Your own source includes only the following as a detrimental effect of pure heroin (the rest it admits come from infectious diseases, injection, or additives):

Heroin creates conditions of bad health over all, making the body susceptible to illness. Liver disease and pneumonia are just a couple of the problems that can result from the body's lowered immune system abilities.

Which is just
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Click Here To Register Today... and misleading. As your source mentions further down, and as my sources mention, liver disease and pneumonia are only encountered when the heroin is contaminated or users share needles.
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Click Here To Register Today it in less lunatic countries.

Even your own source lists no more negative effects from pure heroin.

Now (like everyone else) you will never post in this thread again... like I predicted in the beginning.

• Heroin is extremely difficult to overdose on by itself. -Are you sure about this?
• Heroin is harmless in terms of health effects if it is pure. -People will be abusing it to get high, whether or not it's legalized. And it would be illegal to abuse it to get high. It's not going to be pure when people are using to abuse.
• Heroin withdrawal cannot kill you. -But it looks nasty, and when they can't stop, they'll just kill themselves.
• Heroin only has debilitating health effects when it is illegal and cut. -Even when legalized, Heroin will be abused for the fact it gets people high, which causes the debilitating health effects.
• There are more ER visits from Tylenol than heroin. -Really?
• Legalization of drugs decreases their use. -I have to agree with this.

Originally Posted by Uncreative
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• Heroin is extremely difficult to overdose on by itself. -Are you sure about this?
• Heroin is harmless in terms of health effects if it is pure. -People will be abusing it to get high, whether or not it's legalized. And it would be illegal to abuse it to get high. It's not going to be pure when people are using to abuse.
• Heroin withdrawal cannot kill you. -But it looks nasty, and when they can't stop, they'll just kill themselves.
• Heroin only has debilitating health effects when it is illegal and cut. -Even when legalized, Heroin will be abused for the fact it gets people high, which causes the debilitating health effects.
• There are more ER visits from Tylenol than heroin. -Really?
• Legalization of drugs decreases their use. -I have to agree with this.

1.) Yes. See
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Click Here To Register Today. Basically, almost no death attributed to overdose is actually because of overdose. Heroin has a high "therapeutic index:" amount taken for effect divided by dangerous amount.
2.) I'm suggesting making it legal to get high off of heroin. "For fun" does not mean "abuse", it means "recreational." And when people are buying it from a regulated, legal source to get high, it does mean it will be pure!
3.) How many people kill themselves over heroin withdrawal? Give me some statistics - because I've never heard of anyone doing this.
4.) It gets people high by messing with their mu opioid receptors. This is fine on its own, as long as you don't mess with them so much they depend on heroin. Then you have to take a lot of heroin (but it doesn't have any other effect). It has bad health effects because it's cut with things like quinine or people use it with dirty needles. Just because something is fun to take doesn't mean it's bad for you.
5.) Actually, no. Heroin causes
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Click Here To Register Today. Those are pretty close numbers, though, especially considering how many more people use Tylenol (everyone in the U.S. except the Amish) than heroin.